181. A First Hand Account of Crown

Welcome back to the For Freedom Podcast. What a great time it is to be serving the Lord. We thank you for your time and effort of listening. We never want to take that for granted. Today's episode, we've got an interview with a lady that attended Crown for a couple of years, right before COVID, and so she's asked her name be taken and changed a little bit. She didn't want her identity revealed, and so we're calling her Brooke, and we hope you enjoy the interview today. It was a great time as we sat down and talked to her for about 30 or 40 minutes or so, and she is a schoolteacher now, and she had to get her degree after she left Crown, and so she talks to a little bit of her experience with that, and so we hope you enjoy today. Hope you enjoy this firsthand account of Miss Brooke's time that she was there. We also want to encourage you to go to our website, check out some things that we've got going on, our cigars, our newest book that we just came out with, and various other little projects that we've got going on. And as always, we just want to thank you for taking your time to listen, and your feedback is greatly appreciated. We thank you for the ones who share, the ones who give us the great feedback that we get. We never want to take that for granted, and we just thank you so much for what you've done. We hope that you enjoy today's episode. We hope that it is a blessing to you, and as always, if you ever have a comment or request or feedback you want to share with us, please do that, and so we hope you enjoy today's episode. For freedom, you set me free, not for chains, not for guilt, not for Pharisee. Grace lit the flame, now I'm puffing peace, cigars and victory justified, released. Welcome to the For Freedom Podcast. This podcast exists to bring the freedom of the gospel for everyday Christians with everyday issues. I ain't saved by dress codes, not by what I eat. I'm covered in the righteousness, washed from head to feet. No tally of tradition, no man-made code. Blood bought my freedom, now I ride that road. They clutch pearls when they see smoke rings rise. But my praise still ascends past the legalist cries. Christ plus nothing, that's the real math. So miss me with your fence laws and your extra path. He sat with sinners, I'm sitting with saints. Sipping grace from the bottle, no room for fakes. I light one for liberty, toast to the king. Every ash a sermon, death has lost its sting. For freedom, you set me free, not for chains, not for guilt, not for Pharisee. Grace lit the flame, now I'm puffing peace, cigars and victory justified, released. For freedom, you set me free, not for chains, not for guilt, not for Pharisee. Grace lit the flame, now I'm puffing peace, cigars and victory justified, released. Let grace begin. For freedom, you set me free, not for chains, not for guilt, not for Pharisee. Grace lit the flame, now I'm puffing peace, cigars and victory justified, released. Now here are your hosts, James Saifert and Brett Martin. All right, we're excited to have Miss Brooke on today, talking about her time at Crown College of the Bible. And what we want to begin with is just asking you a couple of questions about your time there and about your experience at Crown. And so welcome to the show, Brooke. Why don't we start with your arrival? What initially drew you to go to Crown? And what was sort of your expectations going into the journey of the Crown College of the Bible? Right. So honestly, I knew I was going to go to Crown from the time I was a sophomore in high school. That was the first time I visited there. And so I was pretty, I was young. I was around 15, maybe 16 the first time I went. And I grew up, my dad's a pastor. So I grew up in that kind of, I guess, realm of people. And like I knew different preachers that went there and I had heard of it before and things like that. So it wasn't like a completely new place. Like I had heard of it and we had travel groups come to our church and things like that. So I got to know people through there. So yeah, all through high school, I knew that's where I was going to go. My parents pushed it pretty hard. I knew that I was going to go to a Christian college. And like I said, I grew up very much independent fundamental Baptist. So it was kind of like always determined that that's the way that I was going to go. And I grew up very, you know, in a pretty strict household. So the idea of Crown was kind of just like, oh, well, it's not much different than what I'm used to. So I went and visited every year up until I graduated high school. And so I was, I would say initially I was very excited to go. I was excited to kind of have the newness of being away from everybody and getting to meet new people. I did have one like childhood friend that was also going there. So we were able to reconnect and I did make friends initially. So initially I was very, very excited to go and be there and kind of soak it all in. And it seemed like there is, and there is a lot that you can get involved in. And so I kind of at the beginning jumped in full fledged and was honestly excited to be there. One quick follow up before we throw it over to Brett. Are you still independent fundamental Baptist? Is your dad still pastor and is he still independent fundamental Baptist? And do you still go to that church, I guess? Yeah. So my dad still is a pastor, independent fundamental Baptist. I would consider myself Baptist. Baptist, I think that's kind of a, kind of something I'm still figuring out. I don't go to my dad's church anymore. I still live in the area. But as I got a little older and moved out, I just kind of realized that maybe the space was like a good thing. You know, I kind of just wanted my dad to be my dad and not feel the need to have to be like to pastor me as well. Just because I did have some beliefs that were different. And it, I didn't want to butt heads with my, you know, my dad's one of my best friends. So I didn't want that to be like a reason to butt heads. And so I felt like putting some space between that and allowing him to just be my dad was the right move for me. That's great. Well, let's talk for a second about some of the positive experience that you had. I mean, classes, friendships, ministry. What were some of the good takeaways that you had from your experience there? So one of them would be that I did get to reconnect with that childhood friend. We had several, several years where we just didn't speak. Um, and so coming into, at first when I found out she was going, I was a little nervous. Um, but then when we saw each other again, it was like time hadn't passed at all. So, um, that friendship is one that I still am like super thankful for. I don't, I think without us going to Crown, we would have never reconnected. And so I'm thankful that we were able to through that. Um, there were lots of ministries that you can get involved in. Um, and that's kind of like a gray area too, because I do think that, yes, they were great to get involved with. Sometimes I feel like they were more like student led. So meaning if there were no students, there would be no ministries. That's kind of how I still feel about that. Um, but for someone who really wants to be involved in ministry, um, it's easy to get plugged into, I mean, several different ones. Um, I personally did the nursing home ministry and I found a lot of, you know, joy in that and it was fun to go and I play the piano. So I was able to use that, um, as well. Um, I also did get, um, picked to be on a travel group. Um, I sing and play the piano. So I auditioned and I got picked, I got put in a group, but then COVID happened. So I never actually got to travel out. And that's something that I really, really, really am disappointed in because I think that probably would have been like the pinnacle, the absolute like best thing that I could have experienced through crown. Um, but sadly I just, I didn't get to because of COVID and our groups didn't go out that year. And then the next summer, I just didn't feel like that's what I wanted to do. So I didn't audition again, but, um, and then as far as friends, friendships are kind of different there and kind of the groups that you are around. I would say I was in one of, I was in one of the groups where it was kind of like crowns, like top, top dogs. You know, they definitely have like their students that they rely on more than the others and that are treated maybe a little bit more like adults than others. And I would say that's one of the groups that I got into. And that was because of who I was dating at the time. Um, so it's definitely kind of like who, you know, there and what, and even relationships, who you end up getting in a relationship with has a lot to do with, um, who you're around, like obviously who you're around and kind of how they view you and as, and they being like administration. So who your friends are, are a big deal because if you're friends with someone that they don't really view as a top dog person, they're not really going to view you as that either. So, um, relationships and friendships are definitely a big deal there. One, one quick followup. You said the D word, uh, dating, this is not an IFB word is courtship. Um, I will say they did use the term dating and they did use the term like boyfriend, girlfriend. Um, I don't know that I didn't technically heard the word courtship much. I mean, I know that there's like students that would come and they would be like, you know, my family believes in courting or whatever, but I will say that the staff there did use the term dating. So what was the classes like again, me and Brett were asking from outsiders. We were not a part of crown. What were the classes like? Were they professional? Did you learn a lot? Or was it just like a Bible class that you'd have in Christian school or what was that like? Um, so obviously no matter what, um, no matter what your degree is in or what you're studying, you're obviously going to have the Bible classes. And one of the big things that, that about crown is that they have the, you know, the trades program. So even if you're in school for HVAC or mechanics, you're still going to have those Bible classes. Um, I originally went, uh, my associates was in, um, like it was like a pre-nursing program. So it was a lot of science classes and things like that. Obviously the first year was a lot of prereqs. So English classes and things like that. Um, I would say that the Bible classes, there were several that I enjoyed and that I learned a lot in, um, obviously growing up as a pastor's daughter, like there were things that were just instilled in my mind as like a five-year-old. And, um, but it did, it did. I, I learned a lot. Like I, I, sometimes I went into it thinking like, I already know all this stuff. I already know the Bible doctrines and things, but there was a lot that I did like learn and that I do appreciate. Um, and, um, the other classes, as far as like science and things, um, there was one science teacher there. He's not there anymore. He was, he's a doctor, a genius, absolute genius of a man. Um, very smart, worked in different countries, has published things in magazines. I mean, he's an amazing doctor, amazing scientist. He's no longer there, but I will say the time that I was there, um, he was very, as far as like the science that I was in, um, classes I was in, he was very just knowledgeable and taught well. I believe he taught, um, in other like public universities and things. Um, there was another science doctor there. He was a heart surgeon, heart doctor, I believe in like Africa. Um, so I mean, they had, um, you know, they had people that were qualified. I think the problem is that they were, they weren't just professors. They were also staff members of the church. And sometimes like, you know, we'd be waiting in a science class and then we'd get an email being like, oh, class is canceled because it's a, it's a busy week at the church or whatever, you know? Um, so I think, yes, they were good professors and things. They just had other responsibilities. And sometimes I think it would like overlap into, you know, our classes and things like that. Whenever, um, there, like I said, there'd be a busy week or a big conference or things like that classes would get canceled. And that's because this, the, our professors were also church staff, if that makes sense. So, yeah. So me and Brett, we both come, Brett came from house and a church. I went to champion in Arkansas. And, uh, one of the things, uh, the sort of our ideas we've been walking through these different colleges is the different cultures of each college. Um, what would the culture of crown as far as their modesty, the music, the separation, um, and how did that personally affect you and your experience with that, um, with the college? Um, I mean, I would say a lot of things would align with Hiles as far as the music. A lot of the music I honestly enjoyed. There was some that I would consider like high church. That would be like a little much for me. Um, but for the most part, I really enjoyed their music, especially in like the college setting. Um, because it was a little, I wouldn't say, I don't want to say laid back, but it wasn't like a church service. It was more Southern gospel kind of, um, even like bluegrass-y sometimes. So, um, I did enjoy the music as far as the modesty. Um, you know, I think maybe a little less strict than Hiles, I would say. Um, I remember even I, I got in trouble a few times for like dress code and things like that. Um, but never anything like super, super major. Um, I know with certain things, Pastor Sexton, he was alive at the time. Um, he was more strict on certain things like lanyards hanging out of guys' pockets were a big no-no for him. Um, they, you know, if they saw guys wearing tighter pants than usual, they would get, you know, call them out and chapel services. Um, the girls, I mean, it's the same IF, IFB rules, if that's what you want to call it across the board, you know, knee-length skirts, um, and, uh, dresses. And obviously they did, I don't know if Hiles does basketball shorts. Crown does allow basketball shorts for girls for like activity stuff. Um, and sometimes that was like frowned upon by like other, you know, like higher, like some of the girls wouldn't be like, we're not allowed to wear basketball shorts. We just wear the culottes or things like that. So, um, but that was one thing that Crown did allow. Um, and again, those had to be like knee-length. Um, I do feel like they were stricter on the girls with modesty. Um, the boys, like the, they could wear their shorts a bit shorter than the girls. Um, so they definitely were stricter on girls than boys. Um, but I would say it was not anything, nothing more out of the ordinary than any other like IFB college, I'd say. Now, before I ask the next question, you brought up Pastor Sexton. Um, can you tell us a little bit about your impression of him and what you thought of, what you thought of him? Um, initially I was very, I guess, impressed. The first time I went as a sophomore in high school, he was very, um, kind, talked to my family. I remember he even like gave us a book for free and like had signed it and stuff. And I mean, of course it was college days and there was hundreds of people on campus. So that was, I feel like that was expected. Um, but if you were to ask me now, I would say that I don't necessarily have the most respect for him because of just of a personal, like run in. I don't even want to say run in, just of a personal experience that I had with him and the, how the conversation went and the way that it make me feel, made me feel. Um, that's just something that I have not been able to get over, but do I think he did amazing things on his time here on earth? Yes, I do. I respect the fact that he built a college from the ground up. I respect the fact that he has campuses, you know, in England and I respect that like fully. But, um, just because of a conversation that we had and how that went and how I just, and certain things that he has said, um, and I think that might be due to the fact that he was getting older too. He was more vocal and maybe a little bit less tactful than he was in the beginning of his ministry. Um, so I don't want to just say that he was a terrible person because I don't believe that. I think he did amazing things and I believe God used him. Um, but I do think that sometimes, um, like I said, I just think sometimes he wasn't as tactful with the college students as maybe he could have been. Well, let's, let's go here. What, were there ever moments where you felt tension between like your personal convictions and the expectations that were placed, uh, on you at Crown? Like you were made to do things, but on the inside you're thinking, well, this, this may not be the best or this, this doesn't match up with what I believe or, uh, go into that for us. Right. So I think when I first got there, like I said, I grew up very in a strict household, very IFB, very, uh, sheltered. So when I first got there, I would say I didn't feel that at all. I was like, oh, I'm used to this. This is what I've grown up. This is normal. This is et cetera, et cetera. And then I think as time went on, um, and I wouldn't even say like, is things that like personal convictions, I would say is more like preferences, like, um, you know, they, you know, no going to the movies there. And well, that's something that I actually grew up doing. So that was like one thing that, oh, we can't go do that this weekend. Cause we're not allowed to. Um, and even just, I don't even want to say like, again, convictions or even preferences. It was just things that like, in my opinion, were like silly. Like, um, girls weren't really supposed to go anywhere by themselves. Like if you were going to Walmart, you had to bring another girl with you, even though Walmart was five minutes down the road and I needed to grab one thing. Technically I could have gotten in trouble by doing that. Um, so I think sometimes things, and I think it was those little things that eventually became like too much because once you, when you have like a bunch of little things that you're like, this is aggravating. Like I'm an adult, I'm 20 years old. Why can I not go to Walmart by myself? Why am I not allowed to go to the gym? Like, you know, things like that. I think that's when it's kind of like, you know what, maybe I don't fully see eye to eye here. Maybe I don't, is this the best thing for me? Like, am I happy here? Um, like having to change who I am based off their rules and what they want us to do. Um, and I think that's ultimately when I was like, I think I'd be happier not here anymore. I've got a follow-up question at, at house Anderson. They always made us feel like we were kids at camp and not like functioning. Yes. You never get that feeling. Yes. Um, a lot actually. Um, there's one person in particular who is not there anymore. Um, who made everyone feel that way. He was a staff. He was, um, he was actually over student life. Um, and I don't know if I'm allowed to like say who it is. Um, so it's actually, okay. So it was actually pastor Sexton's son. His name is Shannon Sexton. Um, and I have no problem saying that he had no business doing what he was doing because he was extremely rude, extremely disrespectful to students, extremely mean. Um, I have several stories about that. My sister has several stories about that. My sister went toe to toe with him once in the hallway and he just looked at her and walked away because my sister was like, I've had, I've had enough of how he's treating us like children and the things he's saying. And she finally said something back and he didn't, he walked away. Um, but he was one that really, when I was there, made you feel like a child. And then, um, even like if you were going anywhere further than 40 minutes away, I think you had to have your parents text administration and be like, I give my child permission to go to Pigeon Forge today on Saturday. Um, even if your family was in town, like if my parents were in town visiting me and I wanted to go stay, you know, at the Airbnb with them instead of my dorm room, my parents would still have to text and give permission for me to stay with them. Um, and then, you know, we weren't allowed to go home on the weekends unless it was a set break. Um, we weren't like, if I just wanted to go home to see my family on a weekend, I was not allowed to do that. Um, so I didn't really like that either. And that was something my parents didn't like either. Um, you know, they always, they had things about Crown they liked, but that was one thing they didn't like. They didn't feel, they didn't like feeling like they were being overstepped as the parent because I mean, when I got there, I was 18 years old. So there were things that I, um, that I, you know, respected them and still asked them about and they helped me with, but Crown kind of like put a cut on that and was like, it was almost like they wanted to be your parent a little bit. But then they would also be like, don't have your mommy and daddy call us complaining about you have your washer and dryers not working in your dorm. Um, we don't want to hear from them. So I don't know. It was kind of like weird because they would want your parents approval, but then they wouldn't want your parents to call and complain about something. So it was just, I don't know. That was aggravating. I can sympathize with both of those things. Um, I was raised where we went to movies, we swam together as guys and girls, like all those were great things. And then we went to champion and it's like, Oh, you can't do this anymore. Um, but then one thing about leaving, um, and having to get permission. So my wife lived in hot Springs. Uh, she was a kid in the school, raised to the bus ministry, reached to the bus ministry, went to the college. Um, and so her first year, her dad made her stay on campus. And so that Thanksgiving, she had put in a request to go home for Thanksgiving, which is still in hot Springs. Mom and dad go to church, everything. And, um, her past was rejected because she'd had too many days away from the college. Um, and so I thought that was hilarious. You know, that that was sort of the mindset they had that even, even local people couldn't even go home. Um, so I was just gonna say it's as bad as it is for the students in general, it's even worse for the girls. And I saw that and I always felt sorry for these girls that at house Anderson, you had to have three girls in a car to leave. And one of them had to be an approved junior or senior. Wow. So I always thought that, you know, those girls are just, they're stuck at the campus. They can't go nowhere. They can't do nothing. I always felt sorry for it. Yeah, there's definitely, I would agree that the, I don't really even know what you would call it. I guess the difference in rules between the boys and the girls was something that made all the girls on campus upset. I wouldn't say all because there were some girls that were like ride or die what the rule says. We're not going to question it. But for the most part, um, girls would get upset about it because the boys were allowed to go to the gym. Um, girls were not allowed to go to the gym. Boys could ride, go wherever they want by themselves. Um, like at not my, the guy I was dating at the time was a resident assistant, an RA. And like he would let, if his guys were hungry, you know, that he would let them leave past curfew and go to the Taco Bell. But if you were to ask a girl RA, Hey, can I go get something to eat? I'm starving. They'd be like, sorry, it's curfew. Um, so yeah, the difference between the guys and the girls is there's, there's, it was definite. It was, it was obvious. Yeah. And I think that's widespread among most IFP colleges. And well, uh, we're going to skip number five. We're going to number six. What was the ultimate decision that sort of led you to never, to not go back to crown? Uh, was this like a turning point decision? Like immediately, Hey, we're not going back or what gradual shift. I know you said COVID came in, so I don't know if that was part of it. Um, what was, what was your experience of not going back? So I had graduated with my associates and then I was going to go back and finish my bachelor's. Um, and I'd gone back that fall semester and my sister was actually there at that point. Um, so we were living together and I loved having my sister there. Um, but then I think I'd brought it up earlier. There was a conversation with me, Pastor Sexton and the guy that I was dating at the time. And after that conversation, I almost had my parents come pick me up that night. Actually, my, I called my parents and my mom was like, if you tell me to come pick you up, because I didn't have my car with me at that. Or did I, I might, I might have had my car at that point. I can't remember. But regardless, my parents were like, if you tell us to come get you right now, I will come get you. Um, so, um, and then I ended up saying, it's fine. I'm going to stay. I'm going to finish out the semester because I don't want to lose the credits that you guys have paid for. Um, so I stayed until December. And then, um, after that semester, I stayed at home and finished online. Okay. Well, let me ask you this. If a high school senior asked you whether they should attend Crown or not, they came to you right now, they asked you this question, what would you tell them? I would say it depends on what you want to do with your life. Because I think if you want to be in the ministry, if you want, especially if it was a male, if you want to be a preacher, a pastor, a missionary, um, or if you're a girl who wants to be a youth pastor's wife, like you just want to be a stay at home mom. You have no interest and, you know, really, you know, you don't have any interest in having a nine to five job. You just want to, um, you know, be in the ministry and that kind of thing. I would say 100% go for it. Um, I would say that you're not going to be steered wrong as far as the ministry goes. Um, I would say, I would, I would have to be honest and say, are you used to these rules? Is it someone like me that grew up wearing certain things and having certain rules? Or is it someone from a public school who heard about this Christian college at a church service? Um, because that's a, that's a big factor. So what was your, like, what's their background like? Because if it's someone who's not used to, you know, those dress standards and a curfew and things like that, it's probably not going to go well for you. But if it's someone who grew up like that and they have a desire to be in the ministry, um, then I would say go for it. I think if you have a desire to, my sister went there and she finished out all four years with, um, her teaching. She did education. There's still some hoops you're going to have to jump through if you plan on teaching in a public school. And I think that's something that they don't tell you up front because there's a lot, a lot of girls that go there for education. And a lot of them do teach in private Christian schools. So, you know, it's, if you don't have a teaching license, that's fine. A license is not required to teach in a private school. But if you have the desire to teach in a public school, I would say just go to a community college, go to a university and go to online and get it there. Because right now my sister's having to jump through hoops to get her licensure and she's going to have to end up getting a master's degree now. Um, and so, yes, it's a good school. But if you plan on having a career that's not just ministry, I would say maybe do some research before you put your money into it. Because you don't want to be done with a degree and then sit back and say, well, I kind of just wasted some money because I didn't really know all the ins and outs of it, I guess. Yeah. We had a friend actually win who recently, uh, went through that same experience. And basically her degree was just a piece of paper and I can redo all four years. She couldn't find a college that would even accept her degree, uh, or accept her classes. There was no syllabuses they could pull to, and then, and it was, it was difficult. And so she just had to redo her entire, uh, education experience and just graduated. Great. Yeah. My, my brother, um, when he was in high school, he did a dual enrollment class. And this is something that I think they should be open and honest about too. And they're not. Um, he did a dual enrollment class for, like, it was like an English comp class or something like that. He did it in high school. He finished it, got an A in it, um, did really well. And then he actually goes to Mississippi State University, um, and that credit that he had from Crown would not transfer over to Mississippi State because they were, they were like, this is like a high school level course. Um, so they did not accept it and he had to end up redoing it or something. Um, so yeah, I would just say even, even the dual enrollment, if that's something you're doing through them, like definitely research and ask questions and ask if you plan on going to another university, like ask questions. Are you guys going to accept this? Because a lot of the time the answer is going to be no. Yeah. Well, Brooke, I know that you are busy. You're teaching right now today and you've got, got to go get, um, or are there any final words that you have, uh, for anyone that may be listening and, uh, then we'll, we'll sign off for today. Um, I just think that kind of what I've said, like, I don't, I'm definitely not anti Christian college. Um, but if it was my own child, I would, I would definitely, and they had interest in a Christian college. It's never something that I would say, no, you're not doing that. That's a bad, I would never say it's a bad idea because I don't think Christian college is a bad idea. I just think it all depends on your situation because yes. And I think people say Christian college is going to protect you, but I'm going to be honest that there's a lot you can get away with. A lot that people did get away with a lot that people were introduced to there that, I mean, is just the same as any other. Are there people like, you know, partying and things like that? Not really. Um, so yes, I guess in a sense you are protected, but, um, there's, there's ways to, the world finds itself into any place and there's going to be people that are bad influences anywhere you go. So I think if, like I said, if you're ministry minded and that's what you want to do, I would say go for it. Um, but if you plan on doing anything as far as a career and you're looking into it, just do your research. 100% do your research, ask questions because you do not want to be in a place at the end of your four years and be upset that you've wasted money and now you're having to basically start over. So that'd be my biggest advice is if, if you plan to go to Christian college, just do your research that you're going to be set once you're done in those four years. Absolutely. Well, thanks for coming on. Thanks for sharing today. Thank you. Thank you for having me. Absolutely. Thanks for being on. And until next time to God be the glory. Yes, sir. Thank you. Thank you. Thanks for listening to the for freedom podcast. If you enjoyed our content, do us a favor by liking, subscribing, or sharing our podcast or whichever podcast platform you use. Be sure to join us next time for the for freedom podcast.

Auto-generated transcript · 6,187 words. May contain errors.